I sat down with Robyn Oxley to talk about the criminal justice and need for abolition in the lands now called Australia. We talk about her journey into and with abolition, why community resourcing and accountability make so much more sense, how prisons simply do not achieve what they purport to achieve (especially in terms of rehabilitation), and the racism and colonial violence that runs all the way through the system – a violence that is entirely in keeping with the colonial project that has wrought trauma, displacement, and death on Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples since British invasion.